This still amuses me. Free The LiveJournal Three! Possible because it's late and I'm immresed in my IRA research and well, I'm trying to make sense of it all and it's nice to have things like this to lugh about so there.
Er...uh...geez, why don't you ask me something *easy* this early in the morning? The thing is that--being a lot fussier about canon and characterization in litslash than I am in other mediaslash--I tend to dislike 95% of what's out there, including the "good" stuff, and thus kind of avoid the fandom entirely. Er...Telanu's Harry/Snape stories aren't bad...don't think you're into Harry/Ron, or I'd rec Mary's "Wish Fulfillment...
And now I'm stumped. Don't like most Harry/Draco by definition, the fandom in general seems hostile to Harry/Ron, many of the people now writing Snapeslash don't seem to grok the idea that, uh, he's not a *nice* man, the Sirius/Remus camp is infested with the same slash-fascist contingent that controls fandoms like The Sentinel and if I see another fucking yaoi characterization in that or any other pairing I may be forced to scream and break things. So I'm not your recs go-to gal, I fears.
Of course, I recommend *my* HP unequivocally, but it ain't finished yet. ;-)
I did like Telanu's Harry/Snape, even if the relationship is mostly lifted from the Qui-Gon/Obi-Wan dynamic.
I didn't understand the Harry/Draco thing when I was reading the books, but the subtext fairly rolls off of their first scene together in the movie.
Why is the fandom hostile to Harry/Ron? It seems like such a sticky sweet fandom would love that relationship. I'd like it if someone would write it well without writing it sappy.
I'd also love to read George/Fred that's actually--gasp!--funny. And I'd really like to read something with George and Fred being funny with a woman, but, then, I'm sick and twisted that way.
I'm not familiar with the slash-fascist contingent. I've been far away from mainstream fandom for a long time.
Were your fic finished, it would have been one of the first HP stories I would have read.
Well, have patience and it will be. I write slow, but I get there in the end. :-)
I know a good (and funny) Forge story, but the writer's taken her stuff underground what with Warner Brothers threatening action so I shan't mention it out here in public. Re the Harry/Ron hostility: Don't ask me, I just work here. I'm an unfashionable sucker for the romantic meant-to-be stuff, so when I find it without honey on top I'm quite happy. Ditto Sirius/Remus.
Re the books, I can accept easily that Draco wants Harry but I simply don't see the reverse being true (which is not to say I don't love a good H/D non-con, but that's about as far as I see it going, YMMV). Of course, the fact that Draco is shaping up as the Matthew Hale of the wizarding world does, shall we say, dampen his appeal to me as anything but an occasional nasty-fuck vehicle.
How is the H/S thing in Telanu like the Obi/Qui relationship? Other than the obvious thing about one of them being a teacher. I've never read much of anything in TPM fandom.
Sometimes I'm a slow writer, but we're approaching exam time, so now I'm writing a lot and quickly.
Could you perhaps e-mail the good twincest author and ask her if you could either give me her e-mail address to ask about it or if she could just e-mail me directly? You know I won't go ratting her out to Warner Brothers.
Hmm. I didn't even see Draco wanting Harry in the books. I saw them as fairly straightforward antagonists. Is there any good H/D non-con out there? Because I could get behind that.
The specific way Telanu writes the H/S student/teacher relationship is very like the way some people write Q/O. (I have yet to read her Q/O, so I don't know if she writes them that way, but I'm sure she's read them that way.) The way Snape is very concerned with propriety even as he's obsessed with Harry is the same way Qui-Gon often acts. The way Snape and Harry are more or less destined to be together, and the way no one else will do, despite the fact that Harry should be an overly-hormonal teenager, is very similar to the Qui-Gon/young Obi-Wan dynamic. And, of course, "One ill-advised snog on a balcony does not create some sort of bond, Potter!" from "Like a Glass" reinforces the Harry Potter-Star Wars analogy. This view is also heavily influenced by the fact that I can't get J.K. Rowling using "the Dark Side" in Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone out of my head. That, of course, is also making me want to write Anakin/Harry.
Re Harry & Draco: I see them as plain old antagonists too, but you could also argue it as Draco having other interests in Harry as well. Good non-con--hmm. Everyone seems to like Lady of Shalott's "A Weather of the Heart" series; her insistence that they're actually really in lurve doesn't do it for me, but whatever. There's got to be a lot more H/D non-con, but I'm at a loss where to find it. Should be an archive full if you ask me.
I just don't see Snape as being concerned with propriety--position, the respect (or fear) of others, yes, but that's a different matter. But I like a good nasty predatory Snape so I'm prejudiced.
I'm still not convinced from the books that Harry and Draco have any genuinely sexual interest between them, but I can see Draco going after Harry in a sexual way as another way to gain power.
Ooh, yes, please on the nasty predatory Snape. Especially since we now all have the visual of Alan Rickman to go with it.
And, erm, at the moment I'm having Snape/McGonagall-it's-just-sex ideas. (Gasp! Het! How will we ever survive?)
Why is the fandom hostile to Harry/Ron? It seems like such a sticky sweet fandom would love that relationship.
Because it's not Harry/Draco! (Seriously. Ask Nat about this some time, she once got "feedback" on her H/R saying "it was good, but it would've been better if it'd been H/D.")
There's a strong tendency in HP fandom to OTP, especially when it comes to the younger generation. (I suspect there's a similar thing with Sirius/Remus in the older generation.) It has to do with the whole fanon image of Draco as Misunderstood Studdmuffin In Leather Trousers Who Really Just Needs Harry's Love To Become A Good Guy.
(Aside: I've always liked Draco's potential and one of the main reasons why I kept on reading the books past book one was because I wanted to see if I was right about what I thought was going to happen to him. I also remember the first H/D stories appearing on HPslash and thinking "Oh, yes, a pairing with lots of possibilities." (Sae once compared it to Mulder/Kryceck.) However, neither Draco's nor the pairing's possibilities are explored at all in the stories I see. In fanon, Draco tends to suffer from the same thing as Spike and Ratboy. I guess people just really want to believe that even the worst jerk can become a nice guy if he just finds love. :/)
The whole OTP thing irks me a lot, even though (especially because?) I like the OTP myself. Because when a pairing becomes the OTP, the quality of the stories usually plummets (and it wasn't too much to begin with, in this case) and well, I do like some variety in my diet. I like H/R as well. And D/R. And good twincest. Or, well, anything that's well-written. If I'd have had more good non-H/D to read about a year ago, I may still be in the fandom.
Bwahahaha! I know that must have been irritating for Nat, but, really, it's funny that someone would like the story but think it would be better if the very foundation of it were changed.
Draco is definitely far more interesting than a misunderstood slash fan's dream who just needs True Love to bring out the good person hiding inside. He could just be a bully, but he could also be a really good evil mastermind. Or, if he does have doubts about following in his father's footsteps of evil, that should be a cause for serious and well-written angst, not something to be solved with the quick fix of Harry's love.
I know it's silly to ask this of a rather dedicated slasher, but do you know of any places to find (relatively) well-written HP het?
That's exactly it. it's not sa if it was som sort of general bunny, it was really only fitting for Harry and Draco. And it'd be much funnier if it wasn't the prevalen attitude in the fandom: "Why would you waste a perfectly good story on Harry/Ron when Harry obviously belongs with Draco?"
For me, part of what made the books interesting has always been the question of wether Draco will just become a DE because his father was, or if he'll actually decide to join, of if he'll decide that Voldie coming into power is going to destroy a lot of things and then what's he (Draco) going toconquer/buy/whatever?
Hm. I did read some het in this fandom, but the only thing that comes to mind atm is Cassandra Claire's Draco Dormiens and sequels, but a) I don't know where that's located these days, and b) large chunks of that are plagiarised.
I can see Draco sort of hanging around the fringes of evil without really becoming his father--semi-rebellious!Draco as it were. I can also see him doing exactly what his father has done because that's what he's been taught to do. Incidentally, when you first read the books and you saw Draco in your head, what color hair did he have?
I'm really interested in non-Hermione het. I like Hermione and all, but I don't really want to think about her having sex. I want McGonagall het, or Weasley twins het, or Snape het.
Bit late in the day for asking this, I know, but what was that whole Cassandra Claire thing all about? Were the stories (which I've never read) plagiarized, or did she write a parody/pastiche and have someone accuse her of plagiarism because of it? (As someone who has quite a few pastiches to her name, I'm understandably interested in the answer to *that* question.) All I recall is a debate in which the definition of plagiarism was very definitively not settled.
Let's see now, the thing Viktor would miss most is Hermione...the thing Cedric would miss most is Cho...naaaaah, pure coincidence and there's absolutely *nothing* slashy about Harry and Ron even though their fight in book four was such an obvious lover's quarrel you couldn't miss it for trying. Evidently, though, many folks are trying their damndest to do just that.
Re ellipses--oh, hell yeah. And this coming from someone who uses them quite a bit herself.
Funny you should mention that. There was actually a Fleur/Gabrielle story posted to HPslash. That caused quite a controversy, though i'm blurry on the details.
Controversy because it was incest? Or because Gabrielle seems so young? Or because if you continue to follow the implications you'll end up at Harry/Ron?
I can maybe maybe see Harry/Ron, or Harry/Hermoine (but honestly, in the first three books, more Harry/Ron MAYBE than Harry/Hermoine.) I just can't see Harry/Draco at all... not in the first three books at any rate. Where are they getting the idea for those two?
I like H/D becuase of the possibilities for the fic. (Sadly, maybe a handful of people have ever actually played with those possibilities. Sadie Dragonfire is one.)
Oddly enough, I didn't really notice the H/D subtext in te movie. I think I was focussing on Snape too much. <g>
Very literal. It's a problem with reading and why I tend to enjoy books with concrete endings and don't leave the reader with a lot of questions...
But because of that, I just have major problems finding any possible relationships based on subtext. I just can't see something sneaky going on in the back ground where two people are doing it. (Which after having seen the movie and than having read the book, ended my twincest kick.) I would think that JK would have told the audience about that... so may speculation in fiction about the possibilities of whom...
See, this is where I go... book based fan fiction not for me. I have a slew of biases against it.
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And speaking of halfway decent HP writers, could you possibly recommend any?
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And now I'm stumped. Don't like most Harry/Draco by definition, the fandom in general seems hostile to Harry/Ron, many of the people now writing Snapeslash don't seem to grok the idea that, uh, he's not a *nice* man, the Sirius/Remus camp is infested with the same slash-fascist contingent that controls fandoms like The Sentinel and if I see another fucking yaoi characterization in that or any other pairing I may be forced to scream and break things. So I'm not your recs go-to gal, I fears.
Of course, I recommend *my* HP unequivocally, but it ain't finished yet. ;-)
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I didn't understand the Harry/Draco thing when I was reading the books, but the subtext fairly rolls off of their first scene together in the movie.
Why is the fandom hostile to Harry/Ron? It seems like such a sticky sweet fandom would love that relationship. I'd like it if someone would write it well without writing it sappy.
I'd also love to read George/Fred that's actually--gasp!--funny. And I'd really like to read something with George and Fred being funny with a woman, but, then, I'm sick and twisted that way.
I'm not familiar with the slash-fascist contingent. I've been far away from mainstream fandom for a long time.
Were your fic finished, it would have been one of the first HP stories I would have read.
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I know a good (and funny) Forge story, but the writer's taken her stuff underground what with Warner Brothers threatening action so I shan't mention it out here in public. Re the Harry/Ron hostility: Don't ask me, I just work here. I'm an unfashionable sucker for the romantic meant-to-be stuff, so when I find it without honey on top I'm quite happy. Ditto Sirius/Remus.
Re the books, I can accept easily that Draco wants Harry but I simply don't see the reverse being true (which is not to say I don't love a good H/D non-con, but that's about as far as I see it going, YMMV). Of course, the fact that Draco is shaping up as the Matthew Hale of the wizarding world does, shall we say, dampen his appeal to me as anything but an occasional nasty-fuck vehicle.
How is the H/S thing in Telanu like the Obi/Qui relationship? Other than the obvious thing about one of them being a teacher. I've never read much of anything in TPM fandom.
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Could you perhaps e-mail the good twincest author and ask her if you could either give me her e-mail address to ask about it or if she could just e-mail me directly? You know I won't go ratting her out to Warner Brothers.
Hmm. I didn't even see Draco wanting Harry in the books. I saw them as fairly straightforward antagonists. Is there any good H/D non-con out there? Because I could get behind that.
The specific way Telanu writes the H/S student/teacher relationship is very like the way some people write Q/O. (I have yet to read her Q/O, so I don't know if she writes them that way, but I'm sure she's read them that way.) The way Snape is very concerned with propriety even as he's obsessed with Harry is the same way Qui-Gon often acts. The way Snape and Harry are more or less destined to be together, and the way no one else will do, despite the fact that Harry should be an overly-hormonal teenager, is very similar to the Qui-Gon/young Obi-Wan dynamic. And, of course, "One ill-advised snog on a balcony does not create some sort of bond, Potter!" from "Like a Glass" reinforces the Harry Potter-Star Wars analogy. This view is also heavily influenced by the fact that I can't get J.K. Rowling using "the Dark Side" in Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone out of my head. That, of course, is also making me want to write Anakin/Harry.
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Re Harry & Draco: I see them as plain old antagonists too, but you could also argue it as Draco having other interests in Harry as well. Good non-con--hmm. Everyone seems to like Lady of Shalott's "A Weather of the Heart" series; her insistence that they're actually really in lurve doesn't do it for me, but whatever. There's got to be a lot more H/D non-con, but I'm at a loss where to find it. Should be an archive full if you ask me.
I just don't see Snape as being concerned with propriety--position, the respect (or fear) of others, yes, but that's a different matter. But I like a good nasty predatory Snape so I'm prejudiced.
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Ooh, yes, please on the nasty predatory Snape. Especially since we now all have the visual of Alan Rickman to go with it.
And, erm, at the moment I'm having Snape/McGonagall-it's-just-sex ideas. (Gasp! Het! How will we ever survive?)
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Because it's not Harry/Draco! (Seriously. Ask Nat about this some time, she once got "feedback" on her H/R saying "it was good, but it would've been better if it'd been H/D.") There's a strong tendency in HP fandom to OTP, especially when it comes to the younger generation. (I suspect there's a similar thing with Sirius/Remus in the older generation.) It has to do with the whole fanon image of Draco as Misunderstood Studdmuffin In Leather Trousers Who Really Just Needs Harry's Love To Become A Good Guy. (Aside: I've always liked Draco's potential and one of the main reasons why I kept on reading the books past book one was because I wanted to see if I was right about what I thought was going to happen to him. I also remember the first H/D stories appearing on HPslash and thinking "Oh, yes, a pairing with lots of possibilities." (Sae once compared it to Mulder/Kryceck.) However, neither Draco's nor the pairing's possibilities are explored at all in the stories I see. In fanon, Draco tends to suffer from the same thing as Spike and Ratboy. I guess people just really want to believe that even the worst jerk can become a nice guy if he just finds love. :/) The whole OTP thing irks me a lot, even though (especially because?) I like the OTP myself. Because when a pairing becomes the OTP, the quality of the stories usually plummets (and it wasn't too much to begin with, in this case) and well, I do like some variety in my diet. I like H/R as well. And D/R. And good twincest. Or, well, anything that's well-written. If I'd have had more good non-H/D to read about a year ago, I may still be in the fandom.
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Draco is definitely far more interesting than a misunderstood slash fan's dream who just needs True Love to bring out the good person hiding inside. He could just be a bully, but he could also be a really good evil mastermind. Or, if he does have doubts about following in his father's footsteps of evil, that should be a cause for serious and well-written angst, not something to be solved with the quick fix of Harry's love.
I know it's silly to ask this of a rather dedicated slasher, but do you know of any places to find (relatively) well-written HP het?
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For me, part of what made the books interesting has always been the question of wether Draco will just become a DE because his father was, or if he'll actually decide to join, of if he'll decide that Voldie coming into power is going to destroy a lot of things and then what's he (Draco) going toconquer/buy/whatever?
Hm. I did read some het in this fandom, but the only thing that comes to mind atm is Cassandra Claire's Draco Dormiens and sequels, but a) I don't know where that's located these days, and b) large chunks of that are plagiarised.
I'll see what i can dig back up, though.
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I'm really interested in non-Hermione het. I like Hermione and all, but I don't really want to think about her having sex. I want McGonagall het, or Weasley twins het, or Snape het.
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H/R outrage, part 2.
"What?" Harry gasped. "They've got . . . they've got Ron?"
"The things Harry Potter will miss most, sir!" squeaked Dobby.
And while I'm at it, am I the only one who thinks J.K. Rowling overuses the ellipse, especially in the fourth book?
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Re ellipses--oh, hell yeah. And this coming from someone who uses them quite a bit herself.
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Probably...
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Oddly enough, I didn't really notice the H/D subtext in te movie. I think I was focussing on Snape too much. <g>
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I'm probably just a very literal person
But because of that, I just have major problems finding any possible relationships based on subtext. I just can't see something sneaky going on in the back ground where two people are doing it. (Which after having seen the movie and than having read the book, ended my twincest kick.) I would think that JK would have told the audience about that... so may speculation in fiction about the possibilities of whom...
See, this is where I go... book based fan fiction not for me. I have a slew of biases against it.
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